Bug#895348: gnome-panel: Description has been misleading since GNOME 3

[Simon McVittie]

Package: gnome-panel
Version: 3.28.0-1
Severity: normal
X-Debbugs-Cc: debian-l10n-***@lists.debian.org, debian-gtk-***@lists.debian.org
User: pkg-gnome-***@lists.alioth.debian.org
Usertags: flashback

gnome-panel's Description currently says:

The GNOME Panel is an essential part of the GNOME Desktop, providing
toolbar-like “panels” which can be attached to the sides of your
desktop. They are used to launch applications and embed a number
of other functions, such as quick launch icons, the clock, the
notification area, volume controls and the battery charge indicator,
and utilities ranging from weather forecast to system monitoring.

However, the GNOME Panel hasn't been an essential part of the GNOME
desktop since squeeze: in wheezy and later versions, its functionality
is normally provided by GNOME Shell. Please apply a new Description that
reflects this, so that the status of GNOME and GNOME-adjacent projects
is clearer.

I think the GNOME Flashback components (-panel, -screensaver,
-power-manager, -applets, -screenshot, etc.) should have a shared
introductory paragraph mentioning that they are continuations of GNOME
2 components, and are no longer used by GNOME 3, but can be used by
GNOME-2-derived desktop environments like GNOME Flashback. Perhaps
something like this?

GNOME Flashback is a continuation of the GNOME 2 desktop user
interface, providing a more traditional design than GNOME 3. It is
suitable for older or more limited hardware where GNOME 3 might
have low performance.
.
The GNOME Panel is an essential part of GNOME Flashback, providing
toolbar-like “panels” which can [etc.] system monitoring.
.
The GNOME Panel was part of the GNOME Desktop before version 3.
Its equivalent in the GNOME 3 desktop environment is part of the
GNOME Shell, so the GNOME Panel is no longer required on GNOME 3
systems.

I've cc'd the debian-l10n-english list for wording suggestions.

I'll open similar bugs for other Flashback and ex-GNOME-2 components
when we have a good suggestion for what to put in their Description fields.

Thanks,
smcv

[Justin B Rye]

[...]

I don't know much about GNOME of any vintage, but I can offer some

Post by Simon McVittie
GNOME Flashback is a continuation of the GNOME 2 desktop user
interface, providing a more traditional design than GNOME 3. It is
suitable for older or more limited hardware where GNOME 3 might
have low performance.
.
The GNOME Panel is an essential part of GNOME Flashback, providing
toolbar-like “panels” which can [etc.] system monitoring.
.
The GNOME Panel was part of the GNOME Desktop before version 3.
Its equivalent in the GNOME 3 desktop environment is part of the
GNOME Shell, so the GNOME Panel is no longer required on GNOME 3
systems.

The one part where I've got any doubts about the English is in the
part covered by your "[etc.]":

notification area, volume controls and the battery charge indicator,
and utilities ranging from weather forecast to system monitoring.
^^^ ^ ^^^
Ands and ands and ands, plus oddly phrased "forecast" alongside
"monitoring". Maybe if they were "forecasts" and "monitors"...

But most of my changes are just attempts to squeeze it into fewer
lines:

GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop user interface
of GNOME 2, for hardware that would struggle with GNOME 3.
.
The GNOME Panel (replaced in GNOME 3 by the GNOME Shell) is an
essential part of GNOME Flashback, providing the desktop with
attachable sidebars. They are used to launch applications and embed
various other functions, such as quick launch icons, the clock, the
notification area, volume controls and the battery charge indicator,
plus utilities ranging from weather forecasts to system monitors.

Then again, are the "quick launch icons" separate from the mechanism
for launching applications, or is this repetition? Is there a
significant distinction between "functions" like the battery monitor
and "utilities" like the system monitor? Perhaps it should be
something like:

attachable sidebars. They provide quick launch icons for applications,
and can embed various other functions, such as the notification area,
volume controls, the clock, and displays for the weather, battery life,
and other system monitors.

(Or should it mention wifi?)

[Simon McVittie]

Post by Justin B Rye
The one part where I've got any doubts about the English is in the
notification area, volume controls and the battery charge indicator,
and utilities ranging from weather forecast to system monitoring.
^^^ ^ ^^^
Ands and ands and ands, plus oddly phrased "forecast" alongside
"monitoring". Maybe if they were "forecasts" and "monitors"...

This is awkwardly worded but not misleading, so I consider it a lower
priority than making the Description stop saying gnome-panel is still
a key part of GNOME.

smcv

[Dmitry Shachnev]

Hi all,

Post by Justin B Rye
But most of my changes are just attempts to squeeze it into fewer
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop user interface
of GNOME 2, for hardware that would struggle with GNOME 3.
.
The GNOME Panel (replaced in GNOME 3 by the GNOME Shell) is an
essential part of GNOME Flashback, providing the desktop with
attachable sidebars. They are used to launch applications and embed
various other functions, such as quick launch icons, the clock, the
notification area, volume controls and the battery charge indicator,
plus utilities ranging from weather forecasts to system monitors.
Then again, are the "quick launch icons" separate from the mechanism
for launching applications, or is this repetition? Is there a
significant distinction between "functions" like the battery monitor
and "utilities" like the system monitor? Perhaps it should be
attachable sidebars. They provide quick launch icons for applications,
and can embed various other functions, such as the notification area,
volume controls, the clock, and displays for the weather, battery life,
and other system monitors.
(Or should it mention wifi?)

I have connected your suggestions, the description on upstream site [1], and
my own thoughts on this, and the result is this description:

Description: traditional panel, used in GNOME Flashback
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using the modern GNOME technologies.
.
GNOME Panel is a part of the GNOME Flashback desktop, and provides panels
and default applets for the desktop. A panel is a horizontal or vertical
bar that can be added to each side of the screen. A panel can contain
various applets, such as the menu bar, application launch icons, the clock,
volume controls, displays for the network connectivity, battery level, and
other system monitors.

Post by Justin B Rye
<smcv> mitya57: it would be great if at least gnome-(session-)?flashback
(but perhaps not -panel etc.) also had a very brief mention of the reason(s)
to prefer -flashback over other GNOME forks
<smcv> mitya57: presumably the advantage of flashback over GNOME 3 is either
that it's better for change-averse users, or better for old hardware, or
some mixture of the two?

So I also propose the following description for the gnome-session-flashback
package:

Description: tranditional desktop session based on GNOME technologies
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using the modern GNOME technologies.
.
The key parts of GNOME Flashback are the GNOME Panel and the Metacity
window manager. All other components, such as the file manager, the
settings center and the various applications, are coming from mainstream
GNOME.
.
GNOME Flashback has lower hardware requirements than GNOME Shell, and
consumes less memory.
.
This package contains the required components for the GNOME Flashback
session. It can be started from a display manager such as GDM.

Do these descriptions sound good from English point of view?

[1]: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/GnomePanel

--
Dmitry Shachnev

[Justin B Rye]

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
I have connected your suggestions, the description on upstream site [1], and
Description: traditional panel, used in GNOME Flashback
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using the modern GNOME technologies.

^^^
That should probably be "using modern GNOME technologies."

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
.
GNOME Panel is a part of the GNOME Flashback desktop, and provides panels
and default applets for the desktop. A panel is a horizontal or vertical
bar that can be added to each side of the screen. A panel can contain

^^^^ ^^^^
"Sides" normally means only left or right; if the default is to put
them at top and bottom, it should really use some other word. And it
isn't necessarily added to each and every one of them. So

bar that can be added to any edge of the screen. A panel can contain
or
bar that can be added to a screen margin. It can contain

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
various applets, such as the menu bar, application launch icons, the clock,
volume controls, displays for the network connectivity, battery level, and
other system monitors.

I think the "and" is misplaced - it's not "such as A, B, C, D,
displays-for-E, F, and G", it's "such as A, B, C, D, and displays (for
E, F, & G)". Also, no "the" in "displays for network connectivity".

So:

Description: traditional panel, used in GNOME Flashback
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using modern GNOME technologies.
.
GNOME Panel is a part of the GNOME Flashback desktop, and provides panels
and default applets for the desktop. A panel is a horizontal or vertical
bar that can be added to a screen margin. It can contain various applets,
such as the menu bar, application launch icons, the clock, volume controls,
and displays for network connectivity, battery level, and other system
monitors.

Post by Dmitry Shachnev

Post by Justin B Rye
<smcv> mitya57: it would be great if at least gnome-(session-)?flashback
(but perhaps not -panel etc.) also had a very brief mention of the reason(s)
to prefer -flashback over other GNOME forks
<smcv> mitya57: presumably the advantage of flashback over GNOME 3 is either
that it's better for change-averse users, or better for old hardware, or
some mixture of the two?

So I also propose the following description for the gnome-session-flashback
Description: tranditional desktop session based on GNOME technologies

^
Typo! traditional

(This makes me feel ancient - I didn't own a computer until I was
middle-aged, and already my desktop is far too old-fashioned to count
as "traditional"... mutter, grumble.)

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using the modern GNOME technologies.

^^^ as above

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
.
The key parts of GNOME Flashback are the GNOME Panel and the Metacity
window manager. All other components, such as the file manager, the
settings center and the various applications, are coming from mainstream
GNOME.

No need for a progressive construction there - just:
, come from mainstream

More pedantically, the style of comma usage we applied above would add
an extra one in this list: "the file manager, the settings center,
and..."

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
.
GNOME Flashback has lower hardware requirements than GNOME Shell, and
consumes less memory.
.
This package contains the required components for the GNOME Flashback
session. It can be started from a display manager such as GDM.

Does this .deb contain all the requored components or just ensure
they're available? If the latter, maybe it should say "provides" -
but that's too pedantic to go in my revised version below:

Description: traditional desktop session based on GNOME technologies
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was
used in GNOME 2.x, but using modern GNOME technologies.
.
The key parts of GNOME Flashback are the GNOME Panel and the Metacity
window manager. All other components, such as the file manager, the
settings center, and the various applications, come from mainstream
GNOME.
.
GNOME Flashback has lower hardware requirements than GNOME Shell, and
consumes less memory.
.
This package contains the required components for the GNOME Flashback
session. It can be started from a display manager such as GDM.

[Dmitry Shachnev]

Post by Dmitry Shachnev
[...]
Description: traditional panel, used in GNOME Flashback
GNOME Flashback continues the traditional desktop interface which was used
in GNOME 2.x, but using modern GNOME technologies.
.
GNOME Panel is a part of the GNOME Flashback desktop, and provides panels
and default applets for the desktop. A panel is a horizontal or vertical
bar that can be added to a screen margin. It can contain various applets,
such as the menu bar, application launch icons, the clock, volume controls,
and displays for network connectivity, battery level, and other system
monitors.

Thanks a lot for your review, Justin!

Now applied in both gnome-panel and gnome-flashback:

https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-panel/commit/ee7cd495f6b48c4b
https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-flashback/commit/bfdcc215e9bba08b

--
Dmitry Shachnev